The great Unlearn Podcast
JW Ross joins The great Unlearn Podcast for a candid conversation about his unique journey to feeling free.
Episode Transcript
Speaker 2 00:00:21 Welcome to the great unlearn. Join me, your host Cal as we dive deep into understanding and unlearning the programming within us. Let's uncover your inner truth for a life with newfound purpose and freedom. Get ready to question it all. In the great unlearn
Speaker 3 00:00:45 That I felt like I was lacking, the ability to feel comfortable in my own skin, to feel comfortable socially. You know, I have everything that I always dreamed of in times 10, and I'm miserable. There was just one moment that was kind of the light bulb moment that really made me finally understand what was going on with me. I pretty much believe everything that I've thought. And, you know, no wonder I'm where I'm at, 80 90% of that's just noise. You don't have to listen to it. And I was always looking for something that would make me feel like alcohol made me feel without the downside. Cuz what I was looking for was something that was not limiting. I wanted something that was enhancing. So the, uh, kava root, it's the root of a pepper plant, again, from the Pacific Islands, mainly used for anxiety and for social lubrication. In those societies, they use it very similar to, we do alcohol here. The Prum, which comes from Southeast Asia, comes from a tree. It's in the coffee family. It's more of a stimulant and a painkiller. But these two combine, there's something really special going on that, uh, is creating something much different than you get either one of them by themselves. So then I started sharing it, you know, with some friends and they're like, oh my gosh, you need to sell this
Speaker 2 00:01:57 Stuff. Some of the greatest products have come out of there being a personal need for something that's not in the market.
Speaker 3 00:02:04 What I decided was missing for me was not only my personal life, but in my business life, is to be doing something, not just for money. Be doing something that actually is gonna provide value to
Speaker 2 00:02:15 Society. I mean, I just got a text yesterday, dude. I drink a half a bottle on my way home and I am super dad. Yeah. It's like, it's amazing. It's
Speaker 3 00:02:23 Being exposed that these plants, if used correctly, can treat a lot of different things, in some cases more effectively than the synthetic things that we've come up with. There are alternatives and we don't have to believe everything they're telling us. The icing on the cake is, you know, when I hear these stories about this is keeping me from doing the synthetic, you know, painkillers or this is creating a better family environment. That's what gets me up every day.
Speaker 2 00:02:52 Well, JW Ross, welcome back to the great unlearn.
Speaker 3 00:02:54 Good to be here
Speaker 2 00:02:55 This time. It's just the great unlearn and not with wellness force with, with my, my brother Josh Trent, which was such a fun episode. Um, so today though, I, there's a lot of stuff I want to cover. It's one of the few times where I do have some notes that I want to make sure we hit on some things cuz there's so much in your story that, um, things gonna benefit people just to hear about your process and, and what inspires you as a man who's had all the measures of success that, you know, our culture holds in high regard. Um, and full disclosure, anyone who's listened to this podcast knows that I'm an investor and feel free, but I'm only an investor because first, I love the product in second. I had a great connection with you when we talked about it. So, uh, and since then, uh, I've, I've reached out to friends of mine who've used the product and wanted to get involved. And so a lot of my friends are now also right part of the, the team
Speaker 3 00:03:58 Feel free
Speaker 2 00:03:58 Team. It's awesome. And even and the ones who, you know, didn't have the, the money to pony up or helping in other ways. And so any, any of my friends that have have experienced it have wanted to be a part of it, which is such a, uh, that's great. Right? It it, for me, it's not necessarily validation cause I didn't need validation. I, I know what I felt, but it's a testament to what this, uh, product that you've created has meant to so many people that I know. I mean, just the, the people that I know so many love the product. So we'll get into that stuff as well. Uh, I think it's important for people who didn't listen to the other episode, or maybe they did and it was a while ago. I'd love to just get, you know, in a snapshot, kind of your background, kind of how you, you know, kind of came into that financial success mm-hmm. <affirmative>, where you were as a man in that, you know, uh, in that experience. And, and then maybe talk about what, what the pivot moment was. And then we'll kind of dig into some of the things that I think are really important for people to hear. So, okay.
Speaker 3 00:05:05 Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:05:07 So, um, I started in oil and gas business in the early eighties. Um, and when I say I started, I started, you know, in the field basically doing, you know, the manual labor worked my way up through, uh, you know, running drilling rigs. Um, and, um, noticed that, you know, the guys that really seemed to be what I wanted to be were the guys that were actually running the expiration companies. And, um, I was able to identify, you know, some stuff I felt it was left behind and went in and, um, was able to raise a little bit of capital from friends and family. And, um, started drilling my own wells and had some, you know, tremendous early success. And that just kept snowballing, um, to the point that, uh, I guess it was by around the mid, uh, nineties that, you know, I had a very sizable company, um, you know, hundreds and hundreds of employees and, um, was making, you know, way more money than what I ever, you know, dreamed that I would make.
Speaker 3 00:06:21 Um, but in that process, those individuals that I looked up at as my mentors, um, in that industry, it was work hard and play hard, uh, really work hard and play harder <laugh>. And, um, I had, uh, from the very first time that I had experienced, uh, a drink of alcohol, which was at about 16, 17 years old, I fell in love, uh, alcohol, you know, for the longest time, gave me everything that I was looking for that I felt like I was lacking. Um, the ability to feel comfortable in my own skin, to feel comfortable socially. And, um, you know, through all that period of time it just continued to escalate. Um, along with then, you know, other things, um, probably my second drug of choice was cocaine. Um, and especially through the late eighties, uh, it was very prevalent and, um, you know, that kind of had its own cycle much faster.
Speaker 3 00:07:33 But I always, you know, the baseline was always alcohol. And, um, you know, the success I'd had, you know, from the outside, you know, the cars, the, you know, 18,000 square foot house, the planes, oats, all this stuff. Um, you know, I found myself, um, you know, having issues. Um, but I was able to cover them up. Um, I was, you know, basically a functioning alcoholic. Um, but I also found myself, um, just not very happy. And I remember as I've talked about this on the previous podcast, there was a very pivotal mo moment when we were having a function at the house and think it was three or 400 people there. And I was by myself sitting in the master bedroom and I was just like, you know, I'm not happy. I have, you know, I have everything that I always dreamed of and times 10 and I'm miserable. And, um, that kind of, you know, very quickly the spiraled even more. And, uh, wound up going to, to treatment, uh, thanks to, you know, some friends around me.
Speaker 2 00:08:54 And so when you say it spiraled more, it was, that wasn't necessarily the moment where the next day you checked yourself in rehab, it was like, here I am, I've done everything. And then, you know, multiples of that they ever dreamed of, I'm not happy, I'm fucked up. I'm gonna continue to numb because I don't know the solution. Or is it, was it that type of thing going? Yeah,
Speaker 3 00:09:18 It was that. And it was also, uh, you know, having been successful in everything that I'd done, I've kept thinking I can figure out how to control this. Mm-hmm. I can have my cake and eat it too. And I kept trying, you know, all the different schemes and, and uh, you know, it just continued to get worse and worse.
Speaker 2 00:09:41 And you said to you, you know, previously, and we've talked about this, but you, you, you weren't, weren't, uh, what you would call like a good person back
Speaker 3 00:09:49 Then? Oh, no, not at all. Which
Speaker 2 00:09:50 Is so hard to believe because anyone who meets you just immediately feels such great energy too, you
Speaker 3 00:09:56 Know? And I think, again, that was, you know, the mentors that I looked up at, you know, when I was growing up, it was all about, you know, them at any cost. And that's, you know, what I've learned, you know, life was about, it was about winning at, you know, at any cost. And, um, I just basically saw everything that around me as, you know, resources Hmm. That I could, you know, use move around the chess board. However, you know, I wanted to move 'em around to accomplish the goal that I was after.
Speaker 2 00:10:36 I think that is so common, um, successful, you know, quote unquote successful or not. I think that is something that, uh, a lot of us struggle with or have struggled with. And I think, I don't wanna put words in your mouth, but it's something that, you know, we, there's been a topic of conversation amongst, you know, my close friends here in Austin lately is when you don't need anything from anybody, you actually start to draw in just amazing people. Cuz they don't need anything from you either. And they're not resources. I'm not a resource. And when someone looks at me or I feel like they're coming to me to use me as a resource, I immediately get a ping. Like, oh, this is not something I want to engage in. This is not this authentic connection where we're just interested in one another and exploring whatever's out there.
Speaker 3 00:11:31 Right. I just, you know, I think that because I grew up in a family that was very distant, um, I just don't think I had any, uh, personal connection with anybody. Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2 00:11:44 <affirmative>
Speaker 3 00:11:45 And I just hadn't developed that, you know, sense of, of you know, what I have now what you're describing. I just didn't, I didn't think about people that way.
Speaker 2 00:11:57 Yeah. And so then you kind of went a little deeper into this and, and then you got yourself some help.
Speaker 3 00:12:04 Yeah. Yeah. I went, uh, to treatment for a 90 day, uh, inpatient. And, uh, that was just a, you know, from going from a running this, you know, huge company, uh, and all these other things to, you know, being, uh, living with, you know, I was living basically with three doctors in a condo at this facility. Uh, it was just a, you know, it was amazing change in, in lifestyle and, and also learning that, you know, this, the treatment center I went to specializes in airplane pilots and doctors, um, just seeing these, you know, surgeons and airplane pilots and what have you, that also had a lot of success going through the same things that I was going through. And, and for the first time ever, you know, I, I don't remember prior to that, you know, having any, what I would call real conversations with, you know, other men. All the conversations I had were around either business or just, you know, out getting, you know, fucked up and, you know, what kind of artificial conversations around all that. And it was just, it was eye-opening for me.
Speaker 2 00:13:29 Yeah. <laugh>, again, I think it's a very common experience. Um, I wonder how were the, how were the other three that were in the condo with you, how did they, uh, do in the experience, were they able to have the, the success in the program that you had?
Speaker 3 00:13:43 You know, what's interesting is, is all three of them, yes. And it, you know, they all had unique stories as to what, you know, uh, what their drug of choice was and what they were doing. But, uh, I've followed, I've kept in contact with them since then, and all three of 'em have, you know, it changed their lives just like it did mine. And I think, you know, the sessions in the treatment center and all that, that was okay. <laugh>, it was the interaction between us, um, living together, cooking meals together, uh, and talking about, you know, things that none of us had really ever, you know, talked about before mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Um, and as I mentioned on the prior podcast, you know, for me there was just one moment that was kind of the light bulb moment that really made, made me finally understand what was going on with me. And, um, we were sitting one evening watching TV and the movie a beautiful mine come on, uh, about, uh, Nash.
Speaker 2 00:14:58 Yeah. John Nash, I believe.
Speaker 3 00:14:59 Yeah. And, um, at the end of that movie, he's walking along, he's doing a lot better, and his arch nemesis is saying, you know, do you still see them? And he looks over and, you know, they're walking along beside him and he said, yeah, I see him. But he said, I've learned not to engage with them. And it just hit me that I was no different than he is. He has maybe a more extreme version of it where he is actually seeing, but I'm hearing it, I'm hearing this voice saying, you can do this, you can control this. And it's just doing it over and over again. And I'm listening to what it says. And then I took that a little deeper of, you know, I started thinking, you know, I've pretty much believe everything that I've thought to this point. Everything that I've thought, you know, I've believed that that was true, <laugh>, and I've acted on it.
Speaker 3 00:15:57 And, you know, no wonder I'm, I'm where I'm at. Um, and it's all about understanding that, you know, 80 90% of that's just noise and you don't have to, you know, you don't have to listen to it. Yeah. So, came out of there and, um, took about a, it was about a year and a half sabbatical after that to try to figure out, you know, what to do the next phase of my life. And, um, wound up of all things, uh, getting into, uh, FinTech and Asia. So a massive change as far as, uh, occupation.
Speaker 2 00:16:39 Yeah. Which is fascinating. And, and it think, it, it, uh, it's great insight into how you operate and how you're kind of not a one trick pony that, uh, and it's one of the things I want to get into today is your ability to take a completely new area, know nothing about it, learn it, you know, create something and then share it. Which I think is, you know, what I've certainly seen with, with feel free, but the beauty of that experience and being over in Asia, it introduced you
Speaker 3 00:17:16 Exactly
Speaker 2 00:17:17 To,
Speaker 3 00:17:17 And I, I think the entire road led to what we're doing now.
Speaker 2 00:17:24 It's is
Speaker 3 00:17:24 So cool because I never would've been exposed to, uh, the plants that, you know, that we're using.
Speaker 2 00:17:30 And so the plants that we're using are, uh, Kan cra but there were other plants over there that you've, you've experienced as well. Is that right? Yes.
Speaker 3 00:17:39 In fact, the, uh, I've done, uh, this is really the second, uh, product that we've, uh, launched. The first product was based off of a superfood called Gak.
Speaker 2 00:17:51 Great. Great. And let, let's, let's dive into the moment that the concept of Feel Free, you know, first came to you.
Speaker 3 00:18:03 So, um, I had been introduced to Kava, you know, decades before, um, just a, a vacation in Vanuatu Pacific Islands. Uh, and it kind of, it was a great experience. We, you know, Bill's chief, a bunch of guys mud hut or mud floor hut sitting around all night during kava and, you know, howling at the sun when it come up mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Um, I can't say that I became a regular user after that, cuz I just went back to alcohol. Um, but it, it stuck in my mind. And then when I was in Southeast Asia, it was introduced to Uhum and, um, you know, when I stopped drinking, um, I still, you know, my life was infinitely better, but I still never really felt comfortable in social situations. And I was always looking for something that, you know, would make me feel like alcohol made me feel without the downside.
Speaker 3 00:19:07 And I would try everything, you know, anything that came on the market that was euphoric or anything, and I'd get my hands on both legal and illegal <laugh>. I would, I would try it. And what I found was that illegal stuff wouldn't do anything. <laugh> and the illegal stuff did too much because what I was looking for was something that was not limiting. I wanted something that was enhancing so that I could do anything I wanted to do, but feel good while doing it. And, um, I mean, for me, I just couldn't find anything that was available that, uh, gave me that. And even the, even the two ingredients, uh, by themselves didn't do it. Um, so I was just sitting around one afternoon and it popped into my head, why hasn't somebody tried to mix these two together? Because they're used, you know, for the same thing in two different societies, uh, similar to what we use alcohol for here. And, um, that started the whole journey of, um, set a lab up in my house and, um, started working with all the different strains, different percentages. My wife thought I'd lost my mind,
Speaker 2 00:20:26 <laugh>, maybe you did for
Speaker 3 00:20:26 A bit. And I, and I probably did a few times. Yeah. But, uh, finally I was able to figure out the right two to go together and the right percentages. And it gave me the feeling that I had been missing. And better than that is it did it without having, you know, any downside. I didn't have hangovers the next day and I actually could go, not only could I could go work out or work or whatever, I actually felt even more enhanced doing it. It felt more focused, felt more energized, and um, you know, I then started sharing it. I didn't really, I think at first I wasn't thinking about doing it commercially.
Speaker 2 00:21:12 This is just for you. You're like, I'm just for trying to Yeah. Which is again, such a great reminder when some of the greatest, uh, products or, you know, inventions have come out of there being a personal need for something that's not in the market. And someone goes out, figures it out and decides that, oh, this is actually should be commercially available.
Speaker 3 00:21:34 So then I started sharing it, you know, with some friends and they're like, oh my gosh, you need to, you need to sell this stuff
Speaker 2 00:21:40 <laugh>. Yeah. And you, so how long ago did you start that kind of process? Cuz it took a couple years. Took
Speaker 3 00:21:46 A couple years to, um, go through the formulation process, and then we actually launched it commercially for sale last May. Wow.
Speaker 2 00:21:56 So we're, we're, we're not much over a year Yeah. Into this. Yeah. And so I've actually never had kava or c Crao on their own, but I know in talking to our friend Khalil, he can't take either of 'em on their own. They both make 'em feel shitty. Yeah. But this combination has been, you know, for him like many others, just magic. Perfect.
Speaker 3 00:22:18 Yeah. It's, uh, the two combined, or these two combined, I can't say that about most of them, but these two combined, there's something really special going on that, uh, is creating something much different than you get either one of them by themselves.
Speaker 2 00:22:36 And can you talk a little bit about what each, you know, the, the cava root and the cranial plant, what they bring to the table, you know, in their kind of profile?
Speaker 3 00:22:47 So the, uh, cava root, um, it's the root of a pepper plant again, from the Pacific Islands. It, um, is mainly used for anxiety and for social lubrication. So they use it in those societies. They use it very similar to, we do alcohol here. The Prum, um, which comes from Southeast Asia, is, um, comes from a tree. It's in the coffee family. And, uh, it's more of a stimulant and a painkiller. Uh, it's mainly used by workers to endure, you know, long days. Not only endure long days, but actually have fun doing it. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> cause it makes you feel good. Um, so that's, you know, by themselves, that's their, their main purpose.
Speaker 2 00:23:38 And are they, are the workers using the, the plant itself or are they using an extract?
Speaker 3 00:23:43 They're using the plant itself. It's, you know, like many things. Not until we got ahold of it here in the west, did we, you know, screw it up.
Speaker 2 00:23:52 We learned how to extract and then make it synthetic.
Speaker 3 00:23:54 Yeah. It, uh, I mean in the native societies, they're brewing, you know, basically a tea with it. Uh, and they're using the full plant material here in the west. We've taken that and basically done the same process they're using to make cocaine. So you take the coco leaf, you use solvents, and you extract two out of 50 some alkaloids, and that's cocaine. They're doing the same thing with both coven c pratum. They're, you know, using solvent or co2, um, in a better case to extract out, you know, certain alkaloids or coones and create the, um, amplified version.
Speaker 2 00:24:40 Gotcha. And that's where, where in, in one of the many ways that this feel free product is different than anything else on the market is that it is the root in the plant that's micro ground. It's
Speaker 3 00:24:52 The full plant material. And, and I've, I've done both. Uh, and there is a major difference, uh, one being is it's, it's a lot easier on your system. It won't elevate your liver enzymes or any of that. Um, the second is it lasts longer and you don't crash off of it. So there hasn't been a whole lot of study done on all those other kavalo tones and alkaloids what they're doing. But the blend of 'em all together is, is helping your body process it and it's, you know, creating a different experience.
Speaker 2 00:25:31 Uh, so when people are Googling traum and they're seeing these studies where there are some negative effects, it's, it's almost entirely from the extract or
Speaker 3 00:25:42 Yeah. There's, uh, very little full plant material in the market. It's, it's almost all either, uh, extracts and or synthetics.
Speaker 2 00:25:51 And how hard was it to, to figure out how to microgram them? I mean, and I, I kind of know the answer, but I'd love for you to share, like, and to actually make it into this tonic
Speaker 3 00:26:02 That, that was the, you know, once I got the combination together, then it was trying to figure out how to, you know, put it into a two ounce bottle like that and, um, keep it stabilized where it didn't set up like concrete. It's very easy to do with extracts, but you know, when you're using full plant material, there's tremendous amount of fiber and that fiber settles in the bottom and, um, it'll set up, you know, like putty or concrete. So I was able to, um, actually borrow some technology that I'd remembered from the oil and gas days and, uh, and, uh, just a process, not a chemical or anything. And, uh, figure out how to, to make it stay and, uh, to keep it from setting up,
Speaker 2 00:26:52 Which is such, again, a great reminder of all the different, you know, that your journey, the things you've been able to pull together for this. And, which is kind of funny. We were talking this morning before we got on, had a bit of a sore throat. Yeah. And so yesterday when we were over at Ted's, uh, Maureen, his wife gave you this tea, which, what's it have in it?
Speaker 3 00:27:13 It's got, uh, slippery elm in it,
Speaker 2 00:27:15 Slippery helm. And it just may be cuz the, the full disclosure, the taste, if you haven't had it yet, the taste is, um, not everybody likes it.
Speaker 3 00:27:26 It's bold.
Speaker 2 00:27:27 It's bold. And so I know you've been working tirelessly to just change the flavor profile without changing the actual kind of chemistry of it.
Speaker 3 00:27:37 Yeah. Not only change the flavor profile, but do it naturally. Yeah. I mean, it, it's, again, it's easy to do if you're using artificial, you know, flavors and things. It's not easy to do when you're trying to stay a hundred percent natural, which is what our shot is.
Speaker 2 00:27:56 So we would just be so, you know, on brand for the slippery Elm to maybe be the <laugh>.
Speaker 3 00:28:03 Yeah. So it's in it last night she gave it to me and I tried it and uh, I had just taken part of a shot, so I still had that flavor in my, you know, my mouth. And I'm like, man, this is good. Uh, and the slippery a itself actually has kind of a soothing quality to it. So, uh, first thing when I get back, that's, I'm gonna try to, uh, see if I can expand on that.
Speaker 2 00:28:28 So, well, tell me this, you, you've, as I've mentioned, you've had this financial success. You're, you're fine, you're set up. What is, what is it about this product that, you know, kind of gets you out of bed every morning? You know, again, you came into this space never having done that, and now you've made it commercially available. So what is it that that allows you to kind of learn that whole process, create this, and I know part of it was just your own need for trying to find something that was enhancing, uh, euphoric and made you better than you maybe would be without it. Right. And then, you know, then to say, I'm gonna, I'm gonna do the thing. I'm gonna like, we're gonna go for it here. Like, how, how,
Speaker 3 00:29:23 You know, I've, I've always, um, been intrigued by different industries and you know, how things really work. And, um, I've never considered myself, you know, the smartest person in the room. But I have a, a good work ethic and I'll put the time in, uh, doing research and networking and figuring the right people to put together. And, and that's really what I did here is I just, I started putting the hours in and, and figured it out. Um, I think to answer your question though, uh, the original question, you know, when I did my sabbatical, um, you know, what I decided it was missing for me was not only my personal life, but in my business life is to be doing something, not just for money, be doing something that actually is going to, you know, provide value to society, not just to me. Yeah.
30 minute Mark
Speaker 3 00:30:22 And, um, that's why I got into the FinTech was it was around, um, providing lower cost financial services for the banked and underbanked unbanked and underbanked and, um, mainly migrant labor. Uh, and then in this, you know, I saw what it did for me and I knew that, you know, that feeling that I was having with, you know, before I found this. And it was like, you know, I need to share this with other people because, you know, once you get to that point, you don't even think about it, the alcohol anymore or whatever drug that is because you just, you don't want it. I mean, even like we were talking this morning, I don't really even want caffeine anymore. And I was drinking caffeine all day long and it just, I don't need it. Um, and then as we were discussing last night, um, you know, because again, I didn't know anything about the industry and I really wanted to connect with people and make sure that it was doing what, you know, I thought it would do.
Speaker 3 00:31:35 I actually was front, I I've been frontline on customer service <laugh> to the point of putting, you know, my number on the boxes and everything else. And, um, it's just been amazing hearing the stories from people, you know, all different types of people age wise, you know, occupation, professional athletes, you know, 65 year old grandmothers and what they're getting out of it, how they're using it. Um, you know, how it's changing in some cases, you know, the, the, um, family relationship, you know, the workaholic dad now is actually engaging with his kids. The wife's, you know, much happier. Um, and that really, when that started happening, that's to me is that's what I've been looking for from the very beginning. Yeah. Or that I should say, I didn't know, you know, that that's what it would, what I was really after, but, but that's what makes me feel fulfilled.
Speaker 2 00:32:45 Yeah. It op it found you like. Yeah. Yeah. That's beautiful. And I, I don't, I wanna, I want to, I don't wanna gloss over the fact that you said that your number is on the boxes and on the websites and when people call, they're calling you. And, and that's right.
Speaker 2 00:33:02 Remember you sharing that last night? We, you know, had a group of us investors together before dinner and, you know, I knew that and a few jaws dropped. Like, how do you do it? And you, you are, you're like, look, it's, it's not sustainable forever. Right. But I need to know the user experience. And I think that it would be very easy for you to have someone else, you know, deal with customer service o on that level, but you're actually getting it from the horse's mouth. You're not getting some version of it where someone may be telling you something different than what's being shared because they may be implicated in them not having a great experience or
Speaker 3 00:33:42 Whatever. That's, that's exactly what happens. And they're gonna sugarcoat things. Yeah. And not really give me the, and, you know, uh, to be the selfish part of me is I really enjoy listening to those people tell me, you know, what, what it's doing for you. Yeah. And I get real value out of that, more so than the, than the money
Speaker 2 00:34:00 That continues the, I'm sure the inspiration to get up every day and, you know, having to make the long drive to the, to the plant and back. And
Speaker 3 00:34:08 I remember when I, you know, cuz I was, I had connected with some mentors in this field too that had been doing it, you know, their entire life. And when I told 'em that's what I was gonna do, they're all like, no, you can't do that. <laugh>. Yeah. That's crazy. You can't do that. You shouldn't do that. You know? Um, and I didn't listen to them and I'm, I'm so glad that I
Speaker 2 00:34:31 Didn't Dude my, it's so funny cuz uh, uh, a a a really good friend of mine, Steve Asen, was just on the podcast and he's, he's been wildly successful as well. And he talked about three different instances when his mentors were like, you're fucking crazy. You can't do that. And he's, he did it. Yeah. And he, he kept getting that response. He's just like, fuck it. This is what I think the right thing to do is. Yeah. And it led him to,
Speaker 3 00:34:59 I think that's what you see, you know, in life. You see people that, you know, will come in from a different industry and move into an industry and, and we'll have a step change, uh, because they don't, they're not preset in, you know, what they think is right and wrong and what you can do and can't do. And they just come in and, you know, and a lot of times they fail.
Speaker 2 00:35:23 Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:35:24 But, you know, you don't know until you try.
Speaker 2 00:35:27 Yeah. You know, one of the things, well you, before I get into that, I would love to talk about, cuz it's always hard for me. People are like, oh, uh, what's it good for? And I used to kind of do the list of things and finally I'm like, what are you looking for? Because basically yes, it will help with that. It has so many applications to people. You mentioned a few, the dad who works a lot, who needs, I mean, I just got a text yesterday, says, dude, I did, I come home, I drink a half a bottle on my way home and I am super dad. Yeah. He's like, he's amazing. My buddies who, you know, I go up to, you know, play golf in the summer and our, our place up in Idaho, it went through there like wildfire. The first guy I gave it to, we were playing golf. He's a great golfer, but he went out and shot 63. For people who don't know golf, it's fucking ridiculous. Yeah. And once people heard that, you know, obviously that helps, right. Uh, people get interested. But, but, but all my friends up there love it. And they can't keep it in the pro shop now because it, it gives you focus and energy. You feel really good and it lowers your anxiety. Me what better thing for golf? Right. And then, or for
Speaker 3 00:36:43 Any
Speaker 2 00:36:43 Sport. Well, and, and then these guys largely like to toss 'em back, you know, a few Bevs on the course. They might have five, six drinks. They're having one, maybe two having to refill their ice. They're not feeling called to the alcohol anymore. And so they're starting to pull away from, you know, look, we all know alcohol is toxic and you know, I know you don't use it anymore. I use it occasionally. It's not my preference. I don't remember the last time I was hungover. But any time for me, if I'm going out to a social event and for going out to dinner, I'm gonna have a little feel free. And it just opens me up. I feel more connected to the people I'm with. I have really good energy. I can talk to someone that frankly I wouldn't normally want to talk to. I'm become more curious.
Speaker 3 00:37:34 Right. Well, it's all check, uh, described as a heart opener. Yes. Which, you know, when you first said that, I'm like, that's kind of a hippy-dippy term. But the more I've thought about it since then, that's really a major part of what it's doing. It's, you know, it's opening you up to be more connected, more curious about how are other people, you know, you know, what's going on with them versus, you know, being consumed inside your head of me. Yeah. And what all am I facing? And, you know, stress and the, it it, to me, it, it turns off a lot of that noise that I talked about earlier on that just, that is just noise, it's thoughts, but you know, it quietens quietens that down and allows me then to really focus on, you know, what I want to focus on or focus on somebody or a specific task working out, whatever it is.
Speaker 2 00:38:40 Yeah. Again, that's a great application, pre-workout, um, for pain relief after a hard session or for, you know, longtime ailments. But I love the, the, that you brought up the heart opening thing. Cause that's something that I always to people, especially the women mm-hmm. <affirmative> because they <laugh>. They're like, well, I need to give some to my husband because
Speaker 3 00:38:59 Yeah, that's
Speaker 2 00:39:00 Right.
Speaker 3 00:39:00 One of the greatest stories, uh, actually was, uh, a lady called me here in Austin and she had ordered it online. And, um, she said, you know, I got this. And she said, you know, I like it. She said, it's not, you know, just didn't set my world on fire. But she said, I, but she said, what I did is I gave my husband some and didn't tell him what it was. And, um, she said about 45 minutes later, uh, she says, two little girls, she said, they come running in. I said, what's, what's wrong with daddy? And she said, you know, what are you talking about? And she said, well, he's not on his phone. He's playing with us. He's giggling, you know, what happened to him, <laugh>. And, um, she went on to say that, you know, that, and this was unsolicited, just call me to, to share this. She said, you know, we had been having issues because she, he seemed not the same man that I married. And she said, you brought my husband back to me.
Speaker 2 00:40:00 Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3 00:40:01 <affirmative>. And I was just like, she said, he's a different person than what he was before. She said he's, he reminds me of what he was when we first met. And that just, again, there's no amount of money that can replace that. So that's a real
Speaker 2 00:40:21 Story. That's a real story. I love that.
Speaker 3 00:40:24 And I just love the fact that she felt compelled to reach out and tell me
Speaker 2 00:40:30 That. Yeah. It wasn't like you saw her at some party and she was a friend of yours or whatever. Like she took the time to reach out. Yeah. And just express her gratitude for, for what this has done for her and her family,
Speaker 3 00:40:41 Not just to me really, you know, exposes me to the value of, of, you know, of people. Mm-hmm. You know, and community and, you know, it's, that's what life's about.
Speaker 2 00:40:55 Yeah. And now you, you're getting what, five, six people reaching out a day? Yes. Yeah. So share, can you share a few more of these stories that, that, that, uh, are inspiring?
Speaker 3 00:41:08 Another one is, uh, I got a call from, uh, from back in the Northeast to grandmother. I think she said she's 65, 66. She's had collapsed ankles for quite some time and she was, um, you know, consuming more and more painkiller, synthetic opioids. And, um, she just said, I want you to know, she said, even with those, she said, my health continued to, and I got to the point where I couldn't hardly even walk. And she said, you know, now I'm totally off of him. And she said, I'm walking, you know, she says, I still have problems, but I'm walking better than I have before. And she said, you know, she goes, I, I know she said that I was on a path that wasn't gonna end well, <laugh>. Yeah. And she said, my life is turned around again. Called me unsolicited. Just wanted me to know that. Keep doing what you're doing.
Speaker 2 00:42:06 Awesome. Yeah. And my, or you know, a a a really close friend of mine here just got outta back surgery, said it was literally the only thing that would allow him to get out of bed each day. Otherwise he, he was immobile.
Speaker 3 00:42:18 Yeah. I mean, I've had, as we've discussed, I've had several conversations with Kerry Hart, uh, who's, you know, former Supercross racer. And, um, he's had just in the last month he's had three different back surgeries. And, um, and he said, this is just the, you know, if it wasn't for this, it would be synthetic opioids. And, you know, he said, I've been down that road before and it doesn't, it's not a nice road. So, I mean, he's, he loves, and again, the same thing. You know, he's married to pink and, uh, you know, the kids and she has, you know, a pretty intense career herself. <laugh>. Yeah. And, you know, he's playing, you know, Mr. Mom. And, and, um, but he said it, it just opens me up and allows me to forget about, you know, my issues and, and really connect even more so with the kids. And, um, and I really got, I got to see that, that he, they did a, she did a documentary, uh, not too long ago. And, you know, it was really fascinating to me to, to see how good of a daddy he actually is cuz they take their kids on tour with them. And, um, you know, that's, that's a lot.
Speaker 2 00:43:39 Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, I love it. And I think you're right. It, it's, it's one of those things that takes you out of the chattering mind of all the shit that you have and you're dealing with. And it drops you into the heart and into the body and it allows you to be there for your kids or for your partner. If you're having a tough conversation. You need to have, like, you each take a little feel free, you know, wait 15, 20 minutes and, and then engage. You can actually listen. Yeah. And drop your own.
Speaker 3 00:44:07 And we actually have, um, speaking of that, we have a number of different types of doctors, whether they be, you know, psychiatrist or whatever, that are now using it in their practice. Um, same thing. They see that, you know, they can give that to their patients and they'll open up more, um, or, you know, wellness centers that are using it before, um, you know, different types of treatments. Um, and people love it. I mean, it just, it enhances experience, whether that's an ice bath or sauna or, you know, lymphatic or, you know, whatever it is you're doing.
Speaker 2 00:44:50 Mm. Yes. And it, well, and, and you also, I don't wanna skip over the, you you mentioned the grandmother that was on opioids now there, the fda mm-hmm. <affirmative> has been trying for years to ban crao. Uh, and it should be a surprise to no one because it can replace, uh, the synthetic opioids that I think everybody would agree is an epidemic here.
Speaker 3 00:45:20 Well, it's killed 800,000 people in the last 10 years,
Speaker 2 00:45:23 So that sounds pretty bad.
Speaker 3 00:45:24 More, more, more than covid.
Speaker 2 00:45:26 So they're, they're, you know, kind of pushing on that end of it. What is your feeling about how that'll all end up?
Speaker 3 00:45:38 Well, what's, what's encouraging to me is finally there's an opening up of acceptance in the West to plant medicines. Um, you know, it's been accepted forever in the east, but finally here, you know, and, and it started with cannabis, uh, you know, cannabis, you know, started down the path of one state says it's okay, then two, then three. Um, that same thing is happening with Crao. Um, states are now starting to pass cram regulation, uh, which is I think a great thing.
Speaker 2 00:46:18 Yeah. What does that look like? Creative regulation.
Speaker 3 00:46:20 Creative regulation. Um, it sets in place, um, standards that it has to be tested for contaminants, whether that's heavy metals or any other kinds of bacteria or anything. It also bans, uh, high concentration extracts in synthetics, uh, which is what's causing, you know, the negativity
Speaker 2 00:46:44 Yeah. The adverse effects.
Speaker 3 00:46:45 Sure. Uh, so I, I think it's a wonderful thing. And like I said, six states now have passed it. Um, and there's approximately 30 more that's in the process of, of coming through. Uh, so I think that, um, you know, that, and then you're also seeing now, you know, in, in some limited areas, the, the psychedelics are starting to, you know, um, it's not just that the government's getting involved also, you know, Harvard and Yale and, and, you know, all these major universities are starting to put a lot of money into research, um, because it's, it's being exposed that these plants, if used correctly, can treat a lot of different things, um, in some cases more effectively than the synthetic things that we've come up with.
Speaker 2 00:47:42 Hmm. We just need a lot more of our politicians to try this plant medicine stuff.
Speaker 3 00:47:46 It's interesting to me because if you look back in the history of Prum, Prum is the only substance ever that was scheduled, and Congress overturned it.
Speaker 2 00:47:58 How did that process work?
Speaker 3 00:48:00 So the FDA in, I think it was 2015 or 2016, uh, was able to get pratum scheduled. So it was federally illegal. Um, hundreds of thousands of people started contacting their congressmen and some of the congressmen too that had been taking it, uh, you know, started talking to each other. And, uh, basically they overturned it. Um, so, um, again, that's never happened before. And since then, the FDA has tried two or three different times to, um, uh, do the same thing and has not been successful. Uh, I think the, to me, I don't believe it should stay the way that it is. I don't think unregulated is right. I think it needs to be regulated just like cannabis does or anything else, uh, to protect the public, make sure that, you know, the quality's right, it's not being adulterated and all of that. And that seems to be, you know, the path that we're going down.
Speaker 2 00:49:05 Yeah. Cause which is great. I mean, and when I, when I mention, you know, to people what's in it, you know, some people actually, most people don't even know anything about creative, but some are just like, Ooh, wow. That's, you know, they have their own story about either their experience or they've heard about it. Or even, you know, my wife Peyton was driving home from Louisiana, you know, months ago, and she drove by some, you know, hillbilly Shaq store that had this big cradle sign, and she's like, this stuff's available there. Like, what's, what's the deal? I said, yeah, it's just, it's not really regulated. So, you know, but it, it, you know, not to judge what kind of c cram they're selling, but it helps people.
Speaker 3 00:49:47 Uh, it's, it's interesting because I tell people that it's probably the largest unknown product in the us. There's 4,500 metric tons a month coming in just from Indonesia. Damn. And if you take the average usage that's tens of millions of people that are consuming it on a regular basis, yet, if you go walk down the street and ask 20 people what it is, odds are, you know, 19 outta 20 of 'em won't know what you're talking about.
Speaker 2 00:50:20 Yeah. I
Speaker 3 00:50:21 Was, which, which to me is fascinating.
Speaker 2 00:50:23 Well, I was surprised because when I was giving it to my friends, particularly, you know, up in Idaho there, I was surprised. They're like, oh yeah, I use Crao. A lot of people were using Crao that I had no idea. And I think there's a bit of a stigma to it Yeah. As well. So it's, yeah. Which sucks. It's like, you keep it, you're hiding it from people. It's not open. Like maybe cannabis is certainly not like alcohol, but,
Speaker 3 00:50:48 Well, there was a point, you know, when cannabis wasn't that way either. That's right. I said, I think there's a, there's a macro shift here, and I, I think what, um, you know, sometimes it takes something really bad to create good <laugh>. And I think what's happened is, is the, the opioid crisis, um, you know, when enough people started dying and some documentaries and shows started coming out, you know, showing really what's going on, <laugh>, why that's happening, that it didn't have to happen. Uh, I think that people started, you know, waking up going, you know, there are alternatives and we don't have to believe everything they're telling us. Uh, it, it's fascinating to me because, and maybe it's because I'm really aware of it, but there's, if you go on, uh, TV right now, there's four or five different, you know, either documentaries or series that are going on right now that basically are the same thing. They're, they're exposing the opioid crisis and how it, you know, how it happened and how it's still happening.
Speaker 2 00:52:10 Yeah. And for those who are maybe looking for their news stations to be reporting on it, don't hold your breath. All these <laugh>, they're, if, if you, if you look closely at who's sponsoring these programs, it's usually Pfizer, probably now Moderna, cuz they have more money than who knows what. But don't, uh, don't always believe. And if, if, if you're still watching that stuff, please stop. It's, it's just poison. It's not true. Most of it, it's, it's, I I won't go down that rabbit hole, but I, I, I still see people that I think are wise with CNN on, or it could be Fox News. I don't care what it is. Just like,
Speaker 3 00:52:54 You just have to realize it's entertainment, please. It's not, it's not real.
Speaker 2 00:52:57 Watch it to say, holy shit, look how slanting this
Speaker 3 00:53:01 Is. This is entertainment.
Speaker 2 00:53:02 But I, the problem is the people that are watching it don't look at it that way. They look at his information. Exactly.
Speaker 3 00:53:07 The,
Speaker 2 00:53:08 The news programs haven't been information probably my entire life. I didn't know that. I finally woke up to that. And now when I am at a friend's house and it's on, I just marvel at the, again, how, how slanted the commentary is. It's not based in fact, um, anyway,
Speaker 3 00:53:29 It's, it's pushing an agenda
Speaker 2 00:53:31 A
Speaker 3 00:53:31 Hundred percent. And, you know, and it's, it's not one way or the other. It's pushing, you know, different agendas. That's right. They're, everyone's doing it.
Speaker 2 00:53:41 Everyone's doing it.
Speaker 3 00:53:42 And it's, you know, it's sad. I, I've always thought that if somebody would launch a news program that just was the facts, you know, and didn't try to take one side or the other, that, that it would, you know, it would do extremely well. But maybe it's not entertaining enough.
Speaker 2 00:54:00 Well, one just got launched and I, I had had an inside look into it, and I'd hosted a party here back in December, I think, uh, Ben Swan, who I think was on Fox News for a while, really just kind of an amazing guy and, and really charismatic, but he launched, I believe it's called sovereign.com, I just saw it officially launched yesterday. S o v r e n.com, which is aiming to be exactly that. Like,
Speaker 3 00:54:32 Let's just, oh, that would be fantastic.
Speaker 2 00:54:34 But you know, that the deep research that, you know, I have access to, you know, not to Ben, but to my friends that have their own researchers for their work. So I get what I feel like is as straight the facts of what's going on as, as I could get. And it is so far from what is, is being perpetrated out there.
Speaker 3 00:54:55 It'll be interesting to see if that really works. Yeah. Um, you know, people like things that are sensationalized and they like, you know, controversy and they're like, you know, oh,
Speaker 2 00:55:08 It's a dopamine hit for them. Yeah. They gotta go
Speaker 3 00:55:10 And may, maybe it's not, uh, maybe the truth's not exciting enough
Speaker 2 00:55:15 <laugh>,
Speaker 3 00:55:15 Which is, which is kind of sad to think about.
Speaker 2 00:55:19 It is sad. But I, I wanna get into something which is fascinating to me. I've been on a number of calls with you, with friends who are potential investors or ended up investing, and I hear all the questions they ask, and I marvel at the fact that you have an an, an answer for every one of 'em. And it's not like the slick guy who's got an answer for everything. It's that, you know, the business so well, you know, every bit of the business. So, well, it's just fascinating shit that I'm like, how does he know that? Like, yeah. How, and is it just you, I mean, is it as simple as you just put the hours in?
Speaker 3 00:56:02 You know, it's something I saw a long time ago is I think it was about the Beatles and, you know, said that the common thought is the Beatles were extremely talented and they just took off <laugh>. And it was saying, you know, that didn't really, that's not really how it worked. They worked for years and years, you know, 10,000 hours, you know, grinding out in these small clubs, honing their craft, and then they got the break and it happened. And I think that, you know, again, realizing that, you know, I'm never gonna be the smartest guy in a room. You know, one thing I can do though is I can work harder than anybody else. And I've always, you know, I wake up extremely early every morning and, um, you know, I pretty mu I don't have hobbies <laugh>, so I don't play golf. I don't do any of that. I, you know, I like working out and I like to do research and it's, it's all about, you know, just spending the hours either researching online reading books, or talking to people that, you know, have been doing it and connecting the dots and it just takes hours and hours and hours.
Speaker 2 00:57:19 Yeah. That's what I love about this too, is you, you been very patient and when a few things haven't gone the right way and there's been hiccups, it's just been unflappable,
Speaker 3 00:57:33 It's
Speaker 2 00:57:33 All good.
Speaker 3 00:57:33 The reality is, is that it's never all gonna go the way you want it to go. <laugh>, you know, there's gonna be problems like we're experiencing now with, um, the, uh, shipments coming in from overseas, you know, but you've, you know, you have to figure out a way to navigate through it.
Speaker 2 00:57:50 Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I just had a, a question pop up in my mind, my, that my wife has asked me a few times, you know, her concern is, is this, uh, use of both the kava and the prum, is it, is it too much of a strain on the, the yield of, you know, both of those, those plants, you know, like you've heard probably there's, you know, they're doing, you know, with Ayahuasca and the San Pedro cactus, right? There's concerns that there's over
Speaker 3 00:58:24 The beauty of, uh, both of these plants is they're very prolific, um, and they don't require a lot of land to produce a tremendous amount of them. Um, you know, part of what I really like about it is they're coming from areas where there's not a lot, not a other, other income sources. Uh, and it's not like this is a huge corporation farming this, uh, it's a co-op of farmers that are working together, and it's, you know, it's providing income for a lot of families that really don't have a lot of other choices in areas that, you know, have a very, very low, uh, standard of living. So, um, it's something that's actually a positive, not a negative.
Speaker 2 00:59:12 Uh, beautiful. And then what's amazing is I don't ever feel like a different, necessarily sensation from it. Like the, the, the profile of it is so consistent, and I've used a lot of this over the last, you know, 10 months. And so how is it that you're able to keep the consistency?
Speaker 3 00:59:37 That's a really good question. So, you know, early on in sourcing, you know, hundreds of different, you know, types and, and from different places, and when I was doing the formulation process, what I noticed was that even getting things from the same place didn't mean it was the same thing. Uh, sometimes purposely, sometimes, you know, not purposely, uh, the testing that I would see, you know, the lab testing and stuff, a lot of it is totally made up. Um, so what I figured out was, if we're gonna, because I'm consuming this myself, I wanna make sure that it's safe, and I wanna make sure that it, you know, it's consistent. And the only way to do that is to do all that ourselves. So we, you know, we test the base ingredients, we test the finished product, and we do that on every single batch.
1 Hour Mark
Speaker 3 01:00:39 And, you know, it's like a lot of, again, if you were dealing with extracts, synthetics, it'd be a lot easier because it's a lot easier to, you know, kind of smooth some of that out. But we're dealing with, you know, plants that, you know, have different seasons and, you know, do you have more rain or do you have more sun? Uh, was the plant more stressed? Um, it's, it's fascinating because now I've, what you were talking about earlier, I've kind of, I'm going down into another level and I'm, um, working with the University of Florida on, you know, why are the plants, um, creating these alkaloids and coones, there's no, there's no apparent reason as to why they have to have 'em, other plants don't have them <laugh>, you know, why are they, you know? Um, and what's fascinating to me is, um, through the work that we're doing at the University of Florida, is we've, we've started to understand why they're doing it. And, um, it's because they're using them, um, as antifungal. Oh, really? So, you know, these plants are grown in, in environments where it's hot and humid, a lot of, you know, different, you know, fungus and bacterias and stuff, and the plants are using it to, um, survive in those environments.
Speaker 2 01:02:09 Oh, that's
Speaker 3 01:02:09 Cool. So one of the things that we're looking at now is, is a, um, is creating, um, antifungal, um, to replace some of the, uh, pesticides that are out there. So it would be a natural, it's, it's actually very effective.
Speaker 2 01:02:27 Oh, that's
Speaker 3 01:02:28 So cool. Yeah.
Speaker 2 01:02:30 Gosh, you just never know what you're gonna turn up when you get in these rabbit holes. Right.
Speaker 3 01:02:33 Something just, I don't wanna go too far down that, but, uh, one of the experiments we, experiments we did was, um, we introduced, we actually have a, there's a planting of, um, prum in, in Florida, and, uh, we introduced, uh, a certain virus, um, or fungus in one side of the, uh, orchard. And, um, then monitored the plants across the orchard to see, you know, what their response was. And the plants are communicating with each other. Come on. Because immediately the plants further away are starting to produce more alkaloids. And when I say communicating with each other chemistries, it's going through the air and the plants realizing that this plant's being attacked and it's changing its alkaloid profile to try to, you know, be stronger to, uh, before the fungus actually gets
Speaker 2 01:03:35 To it. Well, and I tell you, if people wanted to learn more about plants in, in that, what you're talking about, as you're saying that I look at, uh, uh, my bookshelf, the Secret Life of Plants by Peter Tompkins and Chris Bird will blow your mind about the, the consciousness of plants. Yeah. And exactly what you're talking about. It is fascinating.
Speaker 3 01:03:55 Yeah. It's that kind of stuff. I mean, maybe that's kind of geeky, but, uh, that stuff, uh, really does fascinate me. Hey,
Speaker 2 01:04:03 I love geeky. Yeah. <laugh> geeky looks good on you, <laugh>. So, um, I want to make sure we, we talk about, um, kind of usage, you know, guidelines for people Yeah. That, that are, um, interested in trying it. Uh, I know for me, when I share it with someone, I say, look, shake the bottle really well. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> and, um, <laugh>, I actually, let's, let's talk for a moment when, when you tried to change the formula with a little carbonation, and then I tried
Speaker 3 01:04:41 To add a little carbonation just again trying to, um, uh, change the flavor profile a little bit. And, um, unfortunately it didn't work.
Speaker 2 01:04:50 Well, it, it, I think that it tastes better as it goes down a little smoother.
Speaker 3 01:04:54 It tastes better, but the, the fact that you have to shake it
Speaker 2 01:04:57 <laugh> Yeah.
Speaker 3 01:04:58 Uh, to, uh, mix it up, you know, the, the, the, uh, sediment in the bottom of it, uh, doesn't go well with the carbonation.
Speaker 2 01:05:06 No.
Speaker 3 01:05:07 What I was trying to do was trying to, you know, keep a low enough carbonation level that you still could shake it. This didn't
Speaker 2 01:05:16 Work. Yeah. I've had a few of those boxes. Yeah. You just gotta be by the sink when you do it. Yeah. So if you, if you ended up buying some of those, just reach out and, and it'll be replaced. But, but yeah. So shake it really well. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> and I tell everybody, you know, mostly for men like my size, do just do half, do half the bottle. Yeah. For women, I'll say, do a third. Yeah. Just get it a little smaller generally. Um, and then like, again, the, the taste is gonna will the, the mouth, the tongue will get a little numb. So that's, is that the kava?
Speaker 3 01:05:51 That's the, that's the kava doing
Speaker 2 01:05:53 That. That's the kava will do that. The taste isn't, isn't great for a lot of people. So I just say, Hey, look, just have a little, like a strawberry after something that will, you
Speaker 3 01:06:02 Know, kinda Yeah. To, to me it's, and it's, most of the wellness shots don't taste
Speaker 2 01:06:06 Great. No. And to me it's like a reminder. If it tastes really good, maybe it's not great for
Speaker 3 01:06:10 You. Well, I mean, what you described with the, uh, cava, with the Novocain, that's starting the process of, of changing blood, you know, of chemistry in your brain. So it's important that that happens. You don't wanna, you'll get a much different feeling if you take it in pill form.
Speaker 2 01:06:30 Okay.
Speaker 3 01:06:30 And you bypass the tongue Yeah. Throat. Uh, so it's imp it's important that it's doing those things to kind of set the stage.
Speaker 2 01:06:40 Sure, sure. And then I, I also recommend, you know, it's perfect for golf because you take it before you tee off, and then generally you're making the turn so people don't know golf. You play nine holes and then you make the turn. So you play the back nine from the front, nine to the back. Nine usually takes about two hours mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And usually that window for 90 minutes to two hours is when I will do the second half of the
Speaker 3 01:07:08 Bottle. It's the same with me.
Speaker 2 01:07:09 Yeah. Yeah. And, and you know, as much as I've used it, I think there's been, I can count on, you know, one hand the times I've actually done a full bottle at once, and I really, I still don't prefer that. For me, a half bottle is great and then have the rest of it.
Speaker 3 01:07:26 It's, that part's interesting because, you know, because of what I was really trying to create it for in the beginning, for the longest time, I did a full bottle, full two ounces. Yep. And, um, what I found was is that, you know, a half's actually better for me than the full. So it really depends on what you're trying to accomplish with it. You know, a half is gonna get you a euphoric feeling, but it's not gonna be intense to the point that it feels limiting. And you're gonna feel productivity enhancement focus. If you do a full one, you're gonna get more of a buzz. So to me, that's more of, of, you know, the alcohol replacement of having not one drink, but two or three drinks.
Speaker 2 01:08:17 Yeah. And then, you know, as, as we both know, the, the one potential, you know, kind of downside is if you do drink too much of it, you could have some nausea. Yeah.
Speaker 3 01:08:30 And then there are, you know, there's like anything, um, you know, whether you're gluten intolerant, lactose intolerant, whatever, there's a tiny percentage of people that just can't, you know, they're, uh, intolerant to kave and or CRE period. But it's a, it's a very, very small percentage.
Speaker 2 01:08:52 And I always tell people, you can always take more. You can't take less. Yep. Yep. So just figure out what your, you know, what your dosage is.
Speaker 3 01:09:03 I mean, we have a number of people I know, you know, including some of the people that's, um, in the office, um, that just kind of sip it throughout the day. Just tiny sips. And, uh, that works great for them. So it's, some of, it's kind of figuring out what, you know, what works for you. Yeah. I, I agree with your statement though. You, I would always start out with less <laugh>. Yeah. And, you know, stairstep my way up.
Speaker 2 01:09:31 Yeah. And if you tried, you know, a third or a half and you know, I don't know, 20 to 30 minutes later you really don't feel anything, you can take some more, I wouldn't finish the bottle, but I would take some more just to add a little bit to see if that gives you the effects. And Yeah.
Speaker 3 01:09:45 I would, I would wait at least 30 minutes because some people it takes a little longer than others to, to the effect to hit most people it's between five and 15 minutes. But, um, I'd wait 30 minutes and if you hadn't felt, you know, what you want by then, then yeah. Take a little bit more.
Speaker 2 01:10:03 Great. Great. Anything else? We, and like any heads up warnings that we should, and I want to be very
Speaker 3 01:10:09 You, it's, if you're taking a lot of, you know, uh, prescribed medication, um, I'd be careful. I can't say any specific medications. Sure. But, um, you know, it's, you know, these plants are, they're strong and uh, you know, if you mix 'em with a lot of other synthetic medications, you can have things that you don't want to have.
Speaker 2 01:10:38 Gotcha. And I also want to point out that it, you know, mixing it with alcohol is fine as, as in, in my experience, as long as it's, you know, some feel free and a drink and maybe two. But if you're gonna have the feel free and then have 5, 6, 7 drinks might not be, you know, the, the best thing. And, and also you're kind of missing out on the real benefits of the feel free. It's, it's, it's been come, you know, I think for a lot of people in alcohol replacement,
Speaker 3 01:11:10 So what I tell people is you drink the feel free first.
Speaker 2 01:11:13 Yes.
Speaker 3 01:11:14 Because 99% of the people, then they'll either not want to drink at all, or they'll only want, you know, a glass of wine or something and they'll feel fine for the evening. So, um, as opposed, what you don't wanna do is drink a lot and then have that. Cuz it's, it's not a pleasant experience
Speaker 2 01:11:34 <laugh>. No, no. But it is, it is. It's been, um, you know, I noticed for myself, it is what I described to people when relative to alcohol is that when you're drinking alcohol, you're kind of chasing this buzz. You're like, you, you want to have enough to get to that point where you feel really good. And it's really hard to stay in that, that ideal buzz feel free, get you to what I would argue is a better buzz consistently. And you don't have to chase it, it's just you boom, you hit it and you're there for whatever it is, 90 minutes, two hours, three hours. And then as you've said before, it's such a gentle offer ramp. You don't even know you're not on it anymore. You just feel really good
Speaker 3 01:12:21 Still. Yeah. And then, and then the other thing is, most people report that they sleep a lot better at night after consuming it.
Speaker 2 01:12:30 Yeah. Because it is, it, it, you know, I have friends that do use it strictly for sleep aid. Yeah.
Speaker 3 01:12:36 I wouldn't, that's not saying that you drink it right before you go to sleep. Yeah, that's true. But if you drink it, you know, during the day, you're more likely than not, you're gonna have a better night's sleep.
Speaker 2 01:12:46 And you know anyone who's again gonna try this, I challenge you if you're a coffee drinker, instead of having that coffee in the morning, try feel free and see how you feel.
Speaker 3 01:12:57 That's my, that's my favorite application.
Speaker 2 01:13:00 Right. For me, I told you like,
Speaker 3 01:13:02 Wake up in the morning and have a half of half of a shot and it's just like,
Speaker 2 01:13:07 Ugh.
Speaker 3 01:13:07 It's like coffee, you know, to the tenths degree. I mean it, but it's not jittery. It's just, you know, you're just immediately, you're, especially now as I've gotten older, you know, you wake up, you kind of stiff, you got some, you know, pains, <laugh>, I'll do a half a shot and I'm almost like, you know, on fire,
Speaker 2 01:13:27 Fucking well oiled machine ready, ready
Speaker 3 01:13:29 To go.
Speaker 2 01:13:29 Yeah. And it actually brought to mind for me when I tried it and then I went back and did coffee. I was like, oh, I love coffee. I loved the taste of it. I loved the, you know, the, the process of making it, it actually brings me lower than my, my natural state. And so I could started to recognize how much better I felt with the feel free. Yeah. Now I haven't quit coffee altogether cuz there is something about coffee that I enjoy, but I drank maybe half a cup.
Speaker 3 01:13:58 Yeah. I've, as I said, I used to drink it all day long and I'll have, you know, one cup of tea a day now.
Speaker 2 01:14:05 Love
Speaker 3 01:14:06 It. And just, I just don't really want anymore.
Speaker 2 01:14:09 What are you most excited about moving forward in this?
Speaker 3 01:14:12 It's really about, um,
Speaker 2 01:14:14 I mean besides, you know, you and I being partners together,
Speaker 3 01:14:19 It's uh, it's really about hearing all these people talk about, you know, what it's doing for them and expanding that. I mean, we're expanding very rapidly right now. We're, uh, expanding across the country, uh, in brick and mortar. We're adding over 500 stores a month. Um, and, uh, then online also, um, it's just, you know, word of mouth, people, you know, uh, trying it and then just, you know, sharing it with friends and family and I just like seeing that.
Speaker 2 01:14:55 Yeah.
Speaker 3 01:14:56 And, and, and it's, to me, it's the icing on the cake is, you know, when I hear these stories about, you know, this is keeping me from doing the synthetic, you know, painkillers or this is, you know, creating a better family environment that's just, you know, that's what gets me up every day.
Speaker 2 01:15:16 Love it. Any, any, uh, I wanna see like what calls to action if for people out there, um, are, you know, are there any areas in particular looking for sales reps? You know, what, what people listening right now? Yeah. We're,
Speaker 3 01:15:32 As we're, you know, we're expanding out our own direct distribution across the country. So we're looking for a lot of people, sales reps in different, uh, cities. So, um, that's something that we're, you know, working diligently on right now. Um, you know, so anybody that would, you know, be interested in that. Definitely. Uh,
Speaker 2 01:15:55 And can you just, can you disclose what the, um,
Speaker 3 01:15:58 So we pay 25% percentage of all the sales
Speaker 2 01:16:02 To the sales rep,
Speaker 3 01:16:03 The sales reps.
Speaker 2 01:16:04 What's the industry standard
Speaker 3 01:16:06 Say between five and 10
Speaker 2 01:16:08 <laugh>. So why did you do 25%?
Speaker 3 01:16:12 Most companies use third party distributors and they charge 25%. Yep. But that's because that's, you know, that's their business. Uh, we're kind of different and that we're vertically integrated and we're doing all that part ourselves. And my thought was, you know, I'm not really trying to make money with that. Yeah. I'm just trying to, you know, get it out there as fast as I can. So if I give all that to the frontline salesman, that's gonna motivate them even more to treat it like their own business. Ah. And it's gonna expand a lot faster. And, and it's working so far
Speaker 2 01:16:51 And I guess it, it, it kind of calls the herd to, you see the people who are super motivated Yeah. By that and, and their numbers versus others that are just kinda winging it without, without really feeling like they have that ownership in
Speaker 3 01:17:05 It. And it's, what's interesting to me is that the majority of them are what I call true believers. I mean, they're, they've, you know, a lot of them found, you know, found us through having tried the product and then reached out to us and said, you know, what can I do to help?
Speaker 2 01:17:24 Yeah. Perfect.
Speaker 3 01:17:26 Yeah. So they have a passion for what they're doing.
Speaker 2 01:17:30 We talked about athletes before. I know, again, I, my, my golf experience and all my friends. So if anybody's out there that's a golfer, did I definitely recommend you try, if you work at a golf course, reach out. We'll send you some to try. You know, it, it's, I know a lot of golf shops sell cbd mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And when people try this, they're like c b, like is nice better than nothing. But the feel free is, that's such a different, such a different experience. So certainly reach out on on that stuff. Uh, what other sports have you seen besides golf and motocross and
Speaker 3 01:18:08 Pretty much everything. Yeah. From a professional football player, we had a couple athletes in the Olympics that were using it. Um, actually both of 'em medaled. Hmm. Um, I mean, any kind of a sport where you're, you know, you need the energy and the focus, it's, it's wonderful for
Speaker 2 01:18:29 Love it. Question. I never put it in the fridge. Some of my friends like it cold. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, I know. Did, does it still potentially, um, coagulate if it's too cold or
Speaker 3 01:18:44 It doesn't hurt it? Um, that's strictly a, a taste. Yeah. A lot of people like it, you know, chilled, it tastes better. And, and I would say that I'm, it does taste better to me mm-hmm. <affirmative>, but I don't keep it in the refrigerator cause I'm, you know, it's a, it's an acquired taste.
Speaker 2 01:19:04 Yes, it is.
Speaker 3 01:19:05 So the longer you take it, the, you know, the more you actually like the taste. Yeah.
Speaker 2 01:19:10 Well cuz you know what's on the other side of it. Exactly. Yeah. <laugh> like <laugh> have lavian response. Yeah. Uh, and then I've had questions about, you know, is it okay, do you know, is there, you know, I've opened it up. Do I have to drink within a certain amount of time? I don't think so because I've had half bottles laying around my house that I'll just pick 'em up and drink. You know what,
Speaker 3 01:19:31 What I would say is, um, it is, it's shelf stable so you don't have to worry about keeping it refrigerated, but if you open it, you know, anytime you open anything, you're gonna expose it to whatever's in the air. I would then put it in the fridge, uh, just to be safe. Yeah. Probably not, it's probably not absolutely necessary, but just to be safe, I'd stick
Speaker 2 01:19:55 It in the fridge. Okay. Cool. Um, can you talk at all about how sales are going relative to like the main competitor?
Speaker 3 01:20:08 Yeah. It's, it's crazy. I mean, we're um, in one of the major chains, convenience chains in the country. We're outselling Red Bull and five hour combined.
Speaker 2 01:20:21 And the margins are greater for, and
Speaker 3 01:20:22 The mar margins are greater for the stores. So it's just, I mean, that's why we're able to add, you know, 500 stores a month
Speaker 2 01:20:31 And you could probably add more if you had an ability to add.
Speaker 3 01:20:35 Yeah. We still have people.
Speaker 2 01:20:35 Yeah.
Speaker 3 01:20:37 We're, you know, as quickly as we can in every major city in the country, we're adding sales reps, but you can't just, can't just do that overnight. Yeah.
Speaker 2 01:20:46 Yeah.
Speaker 3 01:20:46 I think we added just in the last month, I think we added 20 people, 20 different cities.
Speaker 2 01:20:51 Geez. Any, any hurdles you're, you know, besides the, you know, supply chain stuff, getting the, the packaging from, uh, you know, overseas. Is there anything else that you're trying to navigate?
Speaker 3 01:21:06 Not really. I mean, um, you know, it's, it's mainly down to, you know, supply chain disruption that everybody else is dealing with also. And hopefully, you know, in another year or so that will pass mm-hmm.
Speaker 2 01:21:21 <affirmative> and hopefully we'll maybe get you out here to our neck of the woods.
Speaker 3 01:21:25 Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 01:21:26 Back home <laugh>,
Speaker 3 01:21:28 Seriously, uh, looking at that right now,
Speaker 2 01:21:31 Is my code still active?
Speaker 3 01:21:33 It
Speaker 2 01:21:33 Is. Okay. So we'll share it here. Um, but it will, it's a one-time code mm-hmm. <affirmative>, and I'm sure we'll be ending it pretty soon because it, it, we are ramping up. Uh, but Cal 50, but it'll botanic tonics.com so you get 50% off. Uh, and then once you've tried that sign up for the subscription Yeah.
Speaker 3 01:21:59 The subscription is the best
Speaker 2 01:22:00 Deal. Yeah. Tell me how, how that, um, what you're seeing for people within the subscription model.
Speaker 3 01:22:06 So the subscription is, uh, a 43% discount from what it, you know, normally sells for the 12 bottle case and it's $96. Um, the beauty of subscription is you can cancel at any time, so you're not locked into anything. Um, you know, what we're seeing is now approximately 50% of the new people coming in or starting with subscription from day one, which to me makes sense because again, there's no downside saving 43%.
Speaker 2 01:22:38 Awesome. And then look, if you get in a pinch and you don't have any, go on the website to the store locator. Yep. You'll find one hopefully in your area. Uh, and if not yet, you will soon. Thank you man. Thanks for Yeah, thanks for having me. Thanks for all you've done. Thanks for bringing this into my life. And, you know, it's been amazing to be able to work with you and support you in any way that I can. And I know that I feel,
Speaker 3 01:23:02 Feel exactly the same.
Speaker 2 01:23:04 Everybody you know, that's been involved is we're in such good hands with you. And again, and the complexity of the business is, is is astounding to me, but you've got it so handled and so it feels really good for us to say, what can we do? And, um, generally there's not a, a lot right
Speaker 3 01:23:23 Now actually meant like the, you know, the session we had last night, you know, with a group of us, there's some real interesting things that came out of that that I never would've thought of myself. Yeah. And, uh, I'm gonna go back and try to action them. Um, that stuff is extremely valuable to me.
Speaker 2 01:23:42 Awesome. Great. Well that, that's, you know, we'll, we'll do, we'll do that as, as needed Yeah. To, uh, to check in with that and Oh, I mean, we've got, we've been, we've been at usc. I think that's kind of a cool thing to announce. Yeah. Now
Speaker 3 01:23:56 We're the official tonic of USC athletics. Yeah. Um, so we're at all the games and it's, um, you know, one of the things that I mentioned earlier about the focus, um, and one of the comments I've been getting from a lot of people calling in is they're using it as a replacement. Adderall.
Speaker 2 01:24:18 Oh shit. How about that?
Speaker 3 01:24:20 So a a study aid. Wow. And a and a natural study aid.
Speaker 2 01:24:26 Yeah. Oh, that's awesome. And again, like anytime we can move people from one column, you know, you know, from the synthetic, you know, garbage to the all natural Yep. Feels really good.
Speaker 2 01:24:43 And we are gonna continue to try to expand into that space. Yep. I think we get some other stuff working there that it's gonna be really cool. And then we get a call later today with some people that, um, are within maps. Um, so that'll be, it'll be cool to see the, you know, maps does all the, the, for people who don't know all the, the studies with M D M A and psilocybin and, um, ketamine to try to bring these remedies to people. And so we get to have a call today with some people that have tried the product and are interested to see if there's some way to work it into their studies or into the clinical practices because as, I don't know your experience, but I haven't had, I have had experience with M D M A and one of the, the, the main drawbacks is the next day. Yeah. Or two can be really hard. Yeah. Because you've dumped all this serotonin into your system and the feel free is such a a, a great way to kind of hold you through that period as you have the, the, the re-uptake of that stuff. So that,
Speaker 3 01:25:51 And you know, we've had a lot of people reporting that over-indulge themselves with alcohol that are using it.
Speaker 2 01:25:57 Yeah. Hangover here.
Speaker 3 01:25:58 Hangover the next morning. Yeah. Which I wouldn't know about, but, uh, it's, it's what they're telling me is very effective.
Speaker 2 01:26:05 Yeah. So basically anything that you are curious if it would work for, I would say it's probably likely it'll help. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, uh, botanic tonics.com. It's botanic tos on Instagram, right? Yes. Yes. Okay. We got some cool gear. I got a cool microdose colorful bucket hat that you just sent me. Cool. Uh, are we selling the fanny packs yet? Yeah, we got fanny packs. They're awesome. So glad to have you here in Austin, brother.
Speaker 3 01:26:37 Thanks for having
Speaker 2 01:26:38 Me. We'll see y'all later. See ya.
Speaker 2 01:26:41 You've been listening to the Great Unlearn. For more information, check out their show notes or head over to the great unlearn.com for additional episodes and information regarding events retreats in the T G U store. If you like what you heard today, please click subscribe and share this with friends who might enjoy our platform. Don't forget to leave that five star rating in review as it really helps us spread the love and unlearning. You can find me on Instagram at cal dot Callahan and on YouTube under the great unlearn. Thanks for listening to the great unlearn and we'll talk soon.
Speaker 4 01:27:23 Now. No different, only different. In your mind. You must unlearn what you have learned.
